A-irco.org

I'm going by one of the original links that was posted - and I forget where it was now, I just had it bookmarked. You'll get no argument from me about mixing ages. My only argument is that the mother is partly to blame. I'm tired of beating this dead horse. Hopefully an even handed approach to safety will be taken that can benefit everyone.

<a href="http://www.komotv.com/news/local/12538491.html" target="_blank">http://www.komotv.com/news/local/12538491.html</a>

"Police said the two adults fell off the inflatable toy they were jumping on and landed on the boy, who was standing near them. The names of the adults involved were not immediately released."

<a href="http://www.rideaccidents.com/" target="_blank">http://www.rideaccidents.com/</a>



Greg, are the fees you pay yearly or per event ? The fees we will have to pay are per event.

Ken Martin,

What would it take to get to a true "self-regulating industry?" I know the SCUBA industry is not government regulated other than the DOT with regards to hydro and visual inspections on the tanks (3500 + PSI SCUBA tank is a high pressure container on the road) for transportation purposes. Is there anyway to have the industry stop selling blowers to people that don't have a training certificate? I doubt the blower manufacturers would get on board with it like the SCUBA shops did with providing air to non-certified people.

The only way to self regulate the industry is through some sort of training and certification system such as SCUBA. SCUBA has many certification agencies. SIOTO need not be the only agency and actually it should not be the only one. While Matt, Tammie and others have done a good job, the only way to properly motivate them to continue to update and maintain the current level of dedication they have for it would be to have competition and or a monetary compensation for their time.

Again, the only way to self regulate our industry would be to get the manufacturers on board and I don't think that will happen as there is not a unified voice telling them to get their act together. Heck, you have blower manufacturers going against the ASTM standards with using 14 gauge cords on ALL blowers currently manufactured.

Give a suggestion on how to properly regulate this industry and how to police it. If ASTM is the only idea you have, most of us operators will not support it as most of it does not make sense to us. It needs to be plain English with out the legal speak and needs to be laid out in a common sense way. Currently it tells you to see this standard and that standard and that makes it very difficult to follow for the average operator or even a manufacturer. Most operators would be willing to follow any standard if it was easy and simple to understand.

I am not wanting to pick a fight but these are things I have said before. Until ASTM has the ability to slap a fine on people for not following THEIR standards, then I find them useless as far a regulation.

Amen Barry! Maybe this thread will awake some sleeping giants. I was at an event last night which another large company who does events in other state with regulations. I noticed they had been imspected. If you saw their inflatables you would not rent them. THey had a king of the mountian with the non autobealey system. THeir ropes were fraied and old. Now tell me... If a kid gets hurt cuz a rope snaps you would be on his side because he was inspected. GIVE ME A BREAK!

The point is this... Manufactures made inflatables so cheap that anyone can get into the business. These so called inspectors are full of it. Keep in mind the self inspection inspectors. (Can anyone say loophole?) Its all BULL and until the goverments makes a uniform way of handling the inspections. these problems will still be there.

Can you imagine all the homes that would be built improper if they were to SELF inspect? LMFAO

Currently the ASTM F-24 group has plus or minus 400 people. My guess is less than 5 percent are from the Inflatable industry. As far as the language of the standard that fall on ASTM. I will say the industry has a team of defense lawyers who review and comment on everything that gets passed.

How to make it work. Join ASTM and give input. ASTM is the only game in town other than FEDERAL or STATE Regulation. Recently I had a guy who was looking to buy NJ. They gave him three manuals for one piece, none were the same. As long as the cheap junk keep coming in from who knows where, everybody and their brother will want to get into the business. Quit buying the cheap junk.

People need to get educated on standards. who writes the building code, the building industry. Who writes the electric code, the electric industry. So see it is not just the amusement ride industry.

Anyone can sit back and complain. You have something you want in the industry standards, get it to me with the support of as many people you can get and I will introduce it. Better yet join ASTM and do it your self.

When you see a problem, put people on notice. Make them change.

Maybe AIRCO as a group should start setting some standards and have you introduce it to ASTM. Greg is looking to revamp maybe we should start putting together some standards. Use this tragidy as a positive.

That still doesnt help with the price gauging of the inspectors. I think inspections are needed. I also think it needs to be done by someone other than a company worker more on the lines of state workers. I also believe there should be a fee. But &#036;65-&#036;200 per inflatable is crazy. I would say more by the hour if they need to recoupe paying employees.. Maybe a &#036;25 or &#036;30 per hour. They set up a time with a company and inspect everything at once.

I have over 60 inflatables. I would not pay &#036;200 per piece. Give me a break. Now if it was more like &#036;25 per hour while the inspector was there inspecting. Maybe more people would want to get inspected.

Inspection fee should/could be regulated at the state or local level depending the authority having jurisdiction. Remember Inspectors have the cost of doing business as well. One piece of advice, if you are required to have a third party inspection make sure the inspector is recognized by the authority having jurisdiction and do the have insurance themselves. If they say the states does not require it, as in many states. Encourage the state to pass a law requiring third party inspectors have liability insurance. Or better yet encourage your insurance company to provide pressure to enact the stuff.

Between State permit fee and inspection fee i pay in the area of &#036;10,000 per year plus insurance just get started each year. Those are due 1/1 and expire on 12/31.

We do have all items set up at one time, and he comes and is here for around 5 hours to do all the work sometimes more depending...

[quote:29191522fa="kenmartin"]Inspection fee should/could be regulated at the state or local level depending the authority having jurisdiction. Remember Inspectors have the cost of doing business as well.[/quote:29191522fa]
Hmmmm. So how much would that cost be? &#036;6000 to inspect 60 units? LMFAO Give me a break. &#036;25 per hour is more than enough for a inspector to come look at a inflatable. Ken if you want people to take you seriously then quit your defending inspectors.... i mean cash cows!

Out of curiosity how much do you charge to inspect a inflatable? Justify your fee! Lets hear it.

[quote:29191522fa="GREGHARKINS"]Between State permit fee and inspection fee i pay in the area of &#036;10,000 per year plus insurance just get started each year. Those are due 1/1 and expire on 12/31.

We do have all items set up at one time, and he comes and is here for around 5 hours to do all the work sometimes more depending...[/quote:29191522fa]
&#036;2000 per hour for inspections? LMFAO must be some cost of doing business for the inspectors....

Michael,

For some who comes from a state with no inspection for inflatables I can understand why you don't want inspections. I don't and I have never defended the fees inspectors charge. My only issue is safety. You on the other hand over the months seem to have many issues, some of which I know nothing about and do not want to know. I would worry about what is going on in your state. Inspectors do not set the rate to be charged in a state inspection program. that is done by the local leaders. I suggest you contact them. Perhaps you should give the forum a rest and take care of your issues. Don;t worry your state will be changing the regulations very soon. In fact they are more than likely reading our discussions.

I have no problem with inspections. All of my equipment is in perfect shape and I don't cut corners. Believe me you would be surprised! I would like for there to be some sort of inspections to get rid of the garbage my competitors rent. I also don't care for customer pick ups. I run a very clean operation and anytime your in the area I would be happy to show you my equipment. I know regulations are coming to MI in the next year or 2. Believe me I will be the first to call and rat out people. If I have to have my equipment inspected then so should everyone else.

Also everyone should be insured as well. Not only rental companies but the state run equipment. (they are self insured)

I do however have a problem with the over regulations set about fencing and calling inspectors out to each and ever event to inspect the units before the events start. (in some states, not all)

I also have a problem with inspectors setting their pricing so high that it becomes absurd!

Again Ken you have come up with some of the most ridiculous responses to safety that it doesn't make sense. You also call NJ crap. What makes them crap? You always praise wapallo. Maybe its because you tend to only like what carney people use. You also keep thinking inflatable's are hard rides. They are not! and will never be.

Get over it Ken. If you want to promote safety then do it right and sensible. I am sure everyone on this forum wants to promote safety. I am sure everyone doesn't want kids to get hurt. When you sit and say operators on here are looking to get sued and its only a matter of time. You just sound negative. You seem to hate this industry as a whole. I am sure you wish inflatable's never existed.

I think this is because you are uneducated in what it takes to run a party rental company and how they are run. You keep putting them into a carnival environment. We are NOT carneys!

I think you should open a rental company and learn from it. Then you can open your mouth about what is right or wrong.

Also out of curiosity. How many inflatable's have you actually set up and taken down? What do you know about inflatable's? Have you manufactured a unit before? Do YOU know what the correct engineering is on how they should be built? What makes you an inflatable expert? Why should you be the VOICE of inflatable companies when you are nothing but an outsider who knows about hard rides and not inflatable's.

This topic is closed. Enough of being off topic and the personal attacks!

inflatablegames wrote:

QUOTE:
So the question is, what measures did this facility do to prevent this accident. What are the instructions given to the party before they entered the play floor? Where was the employee to prevent this accident? I get a kick out of some of you that own your indoor facility saying "you cant watch every inflatable all the time". You people who say this should leave the business and NEVER look back. This is the reason for that accident. Clearly they had a serious failure in their system.

Inflatables should be treated as both an amusement ride and a swimming pool. An operator should know where every person is at all times on every inflatable. Why should it be treated like a swimming pool? It only takes a few seconds to drown, it also takes a few seconds to have a serious injury on an inflatable. Your operators are the "life guards" on duty and should be treated as so. If you choose to have only 1 person running 6 games, then the participants should be WELL EDUCATED before entering the arena. I however would not attempt to having 1 life guard watching 6 swimming pools either.

I have an extensive background as a life guard before I came into this business. I have been in the inflatable business for 14 years with only very minor cuts and bruises. Any professional center would have had an operator who would have seen these two grown men and put a stop to it before it happened. We use the 15 second rule. Every inch of the inflatable surface being played on should be seen by our professional staff every 15 seconds. Our staff members are trained to see an accident before it happens.

I feel this company who had the accident was not very professional in their training nor in the way they handled the accident. The center should have shut down after the death of this child. Not only did they not shut down, they cleared the area and brought in the next party. How stupid is this? Any serious injury should shut down the facility and reports should be made. There was not enough time to inspect every game and do all the proper reports before letting in the next party.

I want to finish by reminding everyone that these are "amusement rides". It amazes me that anyone with &#036;1500 and no training can set these up. How would you feel if we opened a Disneyland with only one ride operator with no experience running 6 rides. Not very reasonable is it? If you can't properly supervise these games, then shut your doors so you don't become the next example for the rest of us doing business the "right way". It gives the business a bad name. How can you people say the parents are resposible to watch their kids. THESE ARE AMUSEMENT RIDES PEOPLE! We own these amusements so we are resposible for their safety!

F.Y.I.- We will all pay for this accident. Our insurance rates reflect from these accidents. It is everyones responsibility to watch each others competition and make sure that if you see a hazard, you point it out. Every injury makes your insurance bill go up. If we have a year with minimal injuries, your rates go down.

My cousin is a lifeguard and she's worked at many swimming pools kansas city area. She has often told me about the safety of watching people closely and to be more attentive for problems. I truly am saddened by this accident and I hope in the future operators can be more cautious.